TTC strike: It's on

[mr_conviviality]

http://tinyurl.com/6r26u9

This kind of sucks a lot.

[Kursty]

can someone explain to me how the tinyurl thing works, and why use it?

[mr_conviviality]

oh, it's just because the Globe URL was really long and might have resulted in a funny break that didn't translate. if you go to tinyurl.com it's pretty straightforward

[ssmit]

go to tinyurl.com
type in or copy LONG url
tinyurl gives you a shorter url redirecting you to the original url

you can also use [url] tags for that

[crushkill]

im so glad we got the tinyurl issue resolved, i suppose this ticket can now be closed. thanks guys!

[Ruhee]

OK. Seriously. Screwing the public over by giving NO notice (how much you want to bet they WILL strike at midnight, and everyone who's gone out tonight is going to be absolutely toast) is not exactly the best way to do things. At least announce for Saturday morning or something. Gawrsh. Not to mention I live at York and have to magically find a way for myself and my gear to arrive at the Horseshoe tomorrow. This is going to be a lovely day.

[vreen]

it's official - i hate the fucking ttc. i haven't heard one person voice even a slight sympathy for the fuckers.

[mr_conviviality]

well, if you believe the Toronto Star, TTC workers do get assaulted by the public more than cops. that's pretty shitty.

that said, these tactics are a nightmare. so much for going to Yo! Butter tonight...

[crushkill]

i cant get home from circa

[thecjm]

FUCK YOU TTC. I guess overpaid isn't good enough. And breaking the 48-hour warning promise? That reeks of bargaining in bad faith. The province should force them back to work on their old contract.

well, if you believe the Toronto Star, TTC workers do get assaulted by the public more than cops. that's pretty shitty.

I saw a streetcar driver get "assulted" once. A guy got on with a transfer. The driver said it was too old. The guy argued. The driver argued back. The guy tried to hand his transfer to the driver. The driver pushed the guy's arm away. The guy pushed the driver's hand off his arm. The driver screamed "HE ASSAULTED ME! EVERYONE SAW IT! WE'RE NOT GOING ANYWHERE! I'M RADIOING FOR THE POLICE!"

[bahai superpowers]

The last train westbound was rowdy. people even talked to each other.

[smartygirl]

that's just evil. all of the false assurances and crap. grr, grr.

i don't know what i hate more about the ttc, the unreliability, the crappy service, or the cretins at the city who "manage" it.

oh, but this tidbit from the globe article is great:

But there's another reason he doesn't like the strike:

"I might have to cancel a date on Saturday. That would suck. I don't get many of those."

dude, you are in your thirties. get a taxi already. no wonder you don't get a lot of dates.

[Kursty]

thanks for the tinyurl clarification, guys.

[ddaniel]

pcp strike

[speedlab]

fuuuuuuuuuck

[crushkill]

http://crushkill.com/HOWTOMOLEST.mp3

[drooling]

toronto is broken.

[anthonynemet]

Nice, thanks for fucking over 1929292929292 people

Thanks for the notice too, maybe now there will a few more "assaults"

[winter]

Brutal, they could at least have ended service at the time they stated earlier this week (5am wasn't it?). There are bound to be people who will be suddenly stranded on a Friday night out.

But I'm guessing it happened on Friday so the strike would land on the weekend. I'm willing to bet that there's back-to-work legislation and/or another deal by the morning commute on Monday. I am very thankful that I live in an area where anything I want/need to buy or do this weekend is walkable.

[skeeter]

I've heard through a second hand source, which I can't verify, that the TTC union doesn't fully support their employees who have been assaulted. My mother represented (not litigation) a subway driver who suffered from PTSD after he witnessed a jumper. The union wouldn't pay his full wage on his time off nor his support, eventually they stopped supporting him altogether. There wasn't much he could do at that point, as he couldn't afford to fight the ttc in court. I think it is ironic that the unions chief reason for striking is more pay due to assaults, but on the flipside the union itself doesn't support its own members when they are assaulted. In my opinion, this issue should of been resolved internally, and not the subject of a strike while the gov't, the union, and its member play the money game.

Also I'd like to see the details of the deal which was voted down. As far as I know, it was never published. I am guessing the city bent over backwards to accommodate the union, at the expense of riders (fare hikes in the future). If the public knew what the union was rejecting, I am sure it wouldn't be a pretty sight.

I guess I am just glad I decided to stay in tonight. uggh.

 

[Exocet]

ohh damn.. you don't have the same benefits as other transit employees of other GTA municipalities, get a fuckin job there if the TTC is so bad.  This union bullshit has gone too far.

[Lounge]

I haven't learned anything from this strike yet.  Please carry on


...slowly

[mr_conviviality]

from what i understand, the mechanics are unhappy because the deal included provisions for contracting out their services somewhere along the line. once that word got out, it was labelled a deal for the drivers and not for the mechanics, and they rejected it. support for that position was built throughout the week.

i can't support the decision to strike so suddenly, but some of the mechanics are fighting for their jobs -- wages no longer being an issue. i'm also not in favour of this being called an "essential service", which is just a fancy term for taking away people's right to strike. as much as it sucks for all of us, withholding labour is a right and if everything becomes an essential service, it's far too easy for the bosses to exploit. i know it's a slippery slope argument, but it rings true.

bigger picture is all i'm saying, i guess.

[middleeightjeff]

Bring me the head of Bob Kinnear on a pike! World class city my ass! No wonder they won't ever give us the Olympics, fucking shitty infrastructure!

I'm living in London, ON at the moment and was thinking of moving back to the GTA (Toronto specifically) in June. Now I'm having second thoughts. So much shit has changed for the worse since I've been gone a year.

[Brett]

I am blown away by this. How many people has this union endangered tonight? I can't see these people ever being in the public's favour again. It's the kind of thing people will be talking about for years to come.

The top end of the wage for TTC drivers is $26.58 an hour. By the end of the three-year contract it would've been $29 an hour. Most reasonable people would think that's fair.

Between the 3% wage increase every year, the night-shift premiums, benefits, plus the notorious 'GTA Clause' which ensures they remain the highest paid transit workers in the GTA, what the fuck else do these people want?

There was no strike issue here. Fuck the mechanics. Bob Kinnear said on Sunday after they reached an agreement that the mechanics were getting a 'skilled-trade allowance' which meant they were all getting raises.

This is a critical time for the mayor now. His support largely comes from the unions. But it would be really damaging for him to be seen to be caving to this union, especially now. He needs to wash his hands of these people. It's going to be interesting to see his reaction to this one.

[NNZ]

Lets get together and demand that everyone make minimum wage.  With no benefits.  Hey, I don't make good money, so why should you?  We don't want a shared wealth, we want a shared poverty.  Because the reality is that nobody works as hard as me.  My job is the hardest in the world.  And TTC workers, nurses, teachers and all those public employees are lazy ass bastards.  I work hard and they don't.  They're lazy.  In fact, everybody else compared to me has it easy.  I'm the only one who works hard.  Lets rally for a crappy minimum wage for everybody.  No benefits, no nothing.  If I can't have it than no one can.  I hate unions.  I hate workers.  Like Whitman said, not a slave nor a master have I.  We need a nation of independent entrepreneurs.  If everyone was an independent business person, we wouldn't have a problem with these unions.  We'd just go door-to-door and sell our wares and make our living. 

[danova]

France is so much better at strikes.

[music nerd]

Wow - I am kind of bummed at a lot of the responses to this issue...

By striking at Midnight Saturday they inconvenienced less people than Monday morning.

The union saved the province and the country alot of tax revenue by waiting until Saturday.

The union also gave themselves a window where back to work legislation would not be introduced immediately as council/parliament did not anticipate this move therefore allowing a longer debate window.

The union leaders accepted a deal but the membership refused to ratify the recommended contract.  This is a natural and permissable process of collective bargaining.

More than anything the TTC needs serious support and solution based thought in order to be effective.

Most of the reactions on this board and in my experiences thus far have been blaming the frontline workers who are standing up for themselves and the system.

Most workers engaged in a strike action lose money on the year in which they strike.

I plan to cycle by the picket lines smiling and hoping for a sensible, sustainable and equitable resolution.

[josee]

[rachael]

i am incredibly lucky.
i live walking and biking distance to the majority of things i need.
i can work from home if i need to.
the strike will not affect me all that much.

but, holy toledo, i am furious about the strike.
i do not really care about people who were stranded in clubland last night and had to call their parents in the suburbs to come pick them up.
i do not really care about people who will have to carpool or drive to work, or cancel social plans.
i care about people whose jobs are at risk if they can't get to work.
people with kids and no access to a vehicle, and no money for cabs - they're going to be hurting.
the working poor are going to be hurting.

and i would be more inclined to be supportive of the ttc if i did not witness their drivers being complete jagoffs to passengers on a regular basis.
i do not envy their job, and i often want to yell at passengers myself.
but there is a difference between telling a crowded car to move back, and yelling at an elderly woman for not moving fast enough.

i have lived in many cities, and the ttc is probably the worst transit system i have seen.
granted, i do not know about the transit system of gary, indiana. it may be worse. but, holy bejeesus, this city's transit is a fucking mess.

[angiebear]

I'm totally for cycling and walking due to the strike but last night was a night from Hell for this Deaf woman and her friend with Cerebral Palsy. here's the thing, if I had KNOWN there was going to be a strike, I would've been prepared in term of bringing money and somehow finding a way to get brought back to High Park from Queen street. The fact that I had no idea this shit was happening was terrible for me and my friend. I can't use a phone 'cause I can't hear and people were refusing to make phone calls for me 'cause they were on it bitching to their family/friends about not being able to get home. My friend who rely on a walker to get around were forced to beg for money so she can get a cab home.

I understand the TTC didn't bring up the warning because they were complaining about being verbally abused by the customers but this is ridiculous. Not only are they affecting the able people who probably can't afford cab fare to get to where they're at but they are fucking with the disabled.

Addendum: Because of what had happened last night, I was proven right that the majority of the population don't DO SHIT for the disabled people in a time of need.

[smartygirl]

angiebear, that sucks. but doesn't surprise me, after being pregnant and having people literally shove me out of the way to get a seat on the queen car.

(my baby is deaf btw... we are all trying to learn asl but so far i'm only good with animals and colours)

I've heard through a second hand source, which I can't verify, that the TTC union doesn't fully support their employees who have been assaulted. My mother represented (not litigation) a subway driver who suffered from PTSD after he witnessed a jumper. The union wouldn't pay his full wage on his time off nor his support, eventually they stopped supporting him altogether. There wasn't much he could do at that point, as he couldn't afford to fight the ttc in court. I think it is ironic that the unions chief reason for striking is more pay due to assaults, but on the flipside the union itself doesn't support its own members when they are assaulted. In my opinion, this issue should of been resolved internally, and not the subject of a strike while the gov't, the union, and its member play the money game.

it's not the union's responsibility to pay the wages of employees injured on the job. the gov't has programs set up for that (wsib, ei) which cover 55% or 60% or something of lost wages, and nice employers top that up. what the ttc does that is nasty is offer wage top-ups for management level guys who just sit at a desk all day, but the front-line workers get nada.

which sucks.

but doesn't justify calling a midnight strike on five minutes' notice.

the people in charge are idiots.  i mean, they told us they had an agreement! this has got to be the most poorly-handled negotiation in the history of the ttc.

or perhaps... the world!!!

[NorthernShrubbery]

I made about a thread about this and the lot of you supported the TTC in it. Funny how most of those opinions change when you see the sea of bullshit the TTC causes for people in this city.

[kellywatchthestars]

Looks like commuters were getting violent:  http://www.blogto.com/city/2008/04/ttc_strike_is_back_on_the_table/

"saying that fights were breaking out and a TTC worker had been grabbed and pushed around by angry folks stranded by the strike"

[christopheryan]

The details of the offer that was rejected by the workers is here at Torontoist. Call me naive, but why cant the workers strike by still working but allowing people on for free? That way the only ones hurting are the TTC and the city, which would end the strike pretty damn quick. The people would definitely be on their side if they did it that way. I am pretty sure it has been done in the past in other places, when the labour movement was more militant and organized.

[GrannyGremlin]

This is BS.  Before the last strike deadline all they were bitching about was their compensation packages (Driver safety had dropped off the talking points list - or so the media made it seem).  Now it's the only issue?  This reeks of failed attempt at PR to spin this stupid and cunty warningless walkout into something justified (even moreso given the PTSD story above).  I really don't think the city would begrudge them some budget for driver safety.  This IS about wages/benefits not safety (especially now that the media is calling for economic downturn, and huge inflation of food and gas prices).... bus/streetcar drivers (i.e. all those likely to be assaulted - subway drivers have their own seperate cockpit) are only a small part of the union's membership anyway.  Can you spell pretext.

[buffmedway]

Time to start a TTC RIDERS UNION... strike when they mention fare increases, strike when there are delays on the trains, strike whenever the TTC union cries about something new... strike, strike, strike!

[suffix]

Dear TTC:

Automate the fucking ticket collections already (hell even automate the trains if possible, but that sounds hard), and grandfather out all of those positions. I am not so insensitive as to oblige the little voice in my head that says "FIRE THOSE FUCKERS", as I know how difficult finding new work can be for a lot of older workers, but seriously, why aren't they ALL metropass/token only entrances? Just make student/senior tokens that only work if you also swipe your student/senior card and PRESTO ticket collectors are obsolete. Just one example of how to manage YOUR money so you can stop STEALING mine. Speaking of which, I highly doubt I'm the only metropass holder who feels he/she as been outright ROBBED. I have lived in Toronto my whole life, and have met a lot of positively swell TTC employees. I have also been on strike against my will before, so I hope people's rage towards TTC employees isn't completely blind right now. That said, WTfuckingF?

[thecjm]

Wow - I am kind of bummed at a lot of the responses to this issue...

By striking at Midnight Saturday they inconvenienced less people than Monday morning.

The union saved the province and the country alot of tax revenue by waiting until Saturday.

The union also gave themselves a window where back to work legislation would not be introduced immediately as council/parliament did not anticipate this move therefore allowing a longer debate window.

The union leaders accepted a deal but the membership refused to ratify the recommended contract.  This is a natural and permissable process of collective bargaining.

More than anything the TTC needs serious support and solution based thought in order to be effective.

Most of the reactions on this board and in my experiences thus far have been blaming the frontline workers who are standing up for themselves and the system.

Most workers engaged in a strike action lose money on the year in which they strike.

I plan to cycle by the picket lines smiling and hoping for a sensible, sustainable and equitable resolution.

That is all fair and good. If it's not in a pamphlet from the Workers' Lyceum already, it should be.

But doing this has destroyed any public support for the union from all but most hard-core of lefties. When you reneg on a promise to the public like they did with the 48-hour warning, you're going to piss a lot of people off. When you've already held one wildcat strike and didn't really suffer any consequences and then pull this shit, you're going to piss a lot of people off. And when the public thinks you're already making good money (4 people with university degrees in my household, a TTC driver makes more than any of us) and work for an organization that is desperate for operating funds yet still go on a last minute strike,  it all adds up to a big fuck you to the public.

My theory: the TTC Union had a big strike hard-on and was upset about not getting to blow their load.

[canada_toque]

Time to start a TTC RIDERS UNION...

I was thinking about this myself recently, but couldn't think of a feasible way to make it effective.  But I would love it if basically the population fo Toronto simply stopped working for a day and said "Hey TTC workers, TTC management, city council, Queen's Park: GET YOUR SHIT TOGETHER AND GIVE US A TRANSIT SYSTEM THAT WORKS."